0:00

You are the foundation of your family, you are the firm footing. They build their lives on. You carry a glorious burden and you never dream of laying it down. You carry it with joy and gratitude. You show up. Even when you don't feel like it. You lead, serve, love and protect. You are a father. This is the Dad.Work podcast where men are forged into elite husbands and fathers by learning what it takes to become harder to kill, easier to love and be equipped to lead. Get ready to start building the only legacy that truly matters, your family.

Curt Storring 1:20

Ever navigate how to deal with conflict on this podcast. As it's taken us five recording takes to even get started. So here we go. Welcome to the Dad.Work podcast. Yeah, we're throwing verbal right hooks here. And I'm just kidding. We're obviously just looking at each other with heart eyes now. So anyway,

Natalie 1:38

here we go. Again, getting nothing done.

Curt Storring 1:41

With a baby sleeping on the floor. Oh, she's maybe waking up if you hear a baby crying in the background. Lucky you that is a newborn. So it's awesome. Real life. Yeah, it's real life. Anyway, we're here for another episode, my wife we did one a few months ago. And we're going to ask her some more questions you guys asked. So we'll probably just get into it. And if there's anything that we veer off or want to talk about after then let's do that. So the first one that we got was how long until you trusted that the changes I was making, were there to stay keeping in mind that it took me like literally years to figure this out. And

Natalie 2:12

in one of our failed intros, you were talking about how it took you a long time used to be like mean and scary and all this and you had to like unpack all this stuff, and clean out all this stuff and exercise all your demons and get rid of all this and then become better and how it was all difficult. And that's the stuff that you teach people or share with people now how to do that. And you know, when you're saying that I just got like, so I don't know what made me feel so sad, because that is not you anymore. And like, I remember that I remember you being like, grumpy all the time. But like, I've loved you so much through all of these different stages. And then like, I can remember that and I can feel that. But like, that's so not you anymore. And it's it's so cool. Like, it's amazing that we've like that I've gotten to see so many different versions of you and like this is I mean, this is the best one so far. And if you continue to, like, grow and learn and do stuff. Yeah, it's only gonna get better. How long until I trusted the changes were there to stay? Um, oh, goodness. i Okay, we talked about this in the last one how you were so effective at hacking it down, like piece by piece. So if you said like, this area needs to be fixed, or I'm going to start going to the gym because I want to get more fit. And this discipline is going to help me be a better person or this, like the exercise was gonna help, you know, help my mental health or whatever it is, you would you would do that. And then you would get that thing down. And then you would attack something else and get that down. So because there was the like incremental, like trust and things that I could see that you were doing that you were like, I'm doing that I'm going over there, I'm going to do this and then you would do it. Being able to trust that the big picture was going to happen one day was pretty easy because the small things kept happening. Because you're recently talking about like death by 1000 cuts or whatever it is. Like that's basically like the opposite of that. Like that's how you bolt it up was 1000 1000 Little things that 1000 little things you tell me Yeah, you told me like there's going to be a house here one day and I don't expect there to be a like a magic house appear out of nowhere you like built it brick by brick.

Curt Storring 4:41

So you need to be doing like little things that build yourself up. And these are why we start guys in our programs on the habits because they're just things that over time will build you up to see success. But a lot of guys are like, Oh, I've got to sort it all out right now and oh, I've waited I waited so long. That like I'm now having to do every because she's totally checked out. But I think the small actions like that, and piece by piece, like even in writing Instagram posts, some guy was like, Oh, well, here's something that, you know, maybe you should add to this post. I'm like, bro, this is one thing at a time, like just one idea. And I think that's what we have to be good at, is auditing your life figuring out like, what specific areas can you do work in, and then pick one, and then start doing stuff and be like, Look, I don't know what I'm doing. But I'm gonna do it because you're important to your family. And then you just have to start doing the work. But there was a time where things like, felt better for me, and I knew they were different. I feel like that was when I was sort of like navigating. How do I even open myself up to love because I was scared of really doing that. And you've even asked me like, Do you even love us? Which is like the biggest kick in the nuts? Because I'm like, Yes. And clearly, I can't say that or feel it well enough for you to understand that. But there was like this fear of basically being hurt if I open myself up to anyone, even my wife and kids, which is so sad. But that time actually ties into any other questions. But there was like this testing phase where I was like, hey, you know, these years of stuff we were doing, I'm good. And like, everything's awesome. I can hold space and everything. And whether it was conscious or not, I talked to our guys a lot about this. There was like this testing period, right? And so is that something that you had to go through? That was like a specific time block? Or what, because a lot of our guys have a different trajectory than me. And that was the whole hope, right? Because they're getting results in like three months. And they're like, Wow, everything's like totally different. And their wife's like, yeah, right. So do you remember that sort of transition into like, oh, this, this is actually real man?

Natalie 6:44

Yeah, I remember that. I remember, like, specific sort of, like, not like arguments or conflicts or whatever, between us where like, it would not go the way that I would expect it to. Unfortunately, in some of those situations, I would come away with being like, Oh, I'm the asshole now.

Curt Storring 7:00

Exactly. That's exactly what I'm trying to get the guys to do. Because let me just interrupt for a second, I tell these guys inside of our program all the time, like if you can just hold the line, man, if you can hold space and love and serve, even at her worst, you get to then put the onus back on her. Because here's the thing, as the men, you're the leader, you have to be the one to take action. First, you have to be the one to be an elite man first, before you can expect her to be an elite woman. Now, it is her responsibility to be elite, it is her responsibility to do all the things in her power to be the best wife she can. But until you do the work, drop your expectations, you're not gonna be able to expect that from her anyway. Now, what happens when you do show up? What happens when you legitimately are putting in all the work and doing all the right things? And then the problem is that she can so easily say, Oh, well, you didn't do this. See, it's your problem, she's always able to blame things, because you screw up so much. When you stop screwing up and you actually show up as a mature masculine leader, she's gonna be like, well, those problems are mine. Oh, no. And she's gonna be like, faced with this pain, or hurt or realization that she also has work to do. And you can imagine, if it's been like, not something she's had to see for a long time, that's going to hurt and she's probably going to like lash out. So anyway, back to your realization with us.

Natalie 8:15

I have a few things on that. One being thankfully, like, I was starting to, like, exercise my own demons and clear up my own and have Why were

Curt Storring 8:24

you doing that? Okay, so why were you doing the work because I wanted to bring it to you a lot. And that was not always the way to do it. But like, was my doing it helpful for you doing it? And

Natalie 8:36

yeah, so um, partly because like, you were finding resources, and you were finding ways of doing these things, which I would not have known about, or necessarily gone looking for myself, because I think like, a big part for me was that like, like, a lot of people can like be in pain and have no idea that that's not a way to live. And it's only until the pain goes away that they realized that they were in pain and all. So when you started to clear out stuff, and then you were bringing like these resources to me. Then I went like, Oh, this is a thing that I could do as well. And actually were like, pretty miserable and super messed up. And there's a way to get out of it. But I didn't know that until things started getting better that there was there was nothing that could have been fixed at all. So the thing about like the mid asphalt thing, right? One thing about that or a couple of things about that, is that in all of this, like we were saying, Hold the line, do the thing show up and then eventually it when you've got your side clear, she can see where her issues are. You did not use your possession of sort of your appealed position or your better communicate or anything like that to turn around and be like, Look, I've got all my shit sorted out, you the household now, you know, like there was never anything like that. It was never like, look how good I am now. Like, I know it used to be an asshole but like, guess what, you're the asshole now how does it feel? Who's like none of not because the goal ultimately was to repair this off and then repair the marriage. And I mean, like, that's like the Suffolk era good cuz I'm so when you like go into it with that goal in mind that changes everything to if you can shed the like, feeling like you have to like get back at them for whatever they've done. Because if you're if you've both got your issues and you're really distracted me, I don't know what I'm saying now.

Curt Storring 10:58

Yeah, well, you were talking about, you know, you having been faced with the realization that some of these problems were yours. And you started doing your work. But like, there's I think we're still on some tangent of how long until you trusted me? Yeah. So we're like, I don't know, three or four things in there. But like, I think the specific point, when I was like, things are fine. Now I'm good. I can handle this instead of screaming at you. And you're like subconsciously, like, can you? Do you want to see how I was gonna say how crazy I can get. That's how it felt for me. But it was like, Do you want to see how confrontational I can get to really prove that you've done the work? And it seemed to me, like it got worse before it got better. And that really pissed me off and it like, surprise me. But you just I just kept going through that. And so in this, you're like, oh, there's my problems. Okay, I can actually trust them here.

Natalie 11:57

Oh, the other thing I thought about that is the reason why I think it gets worse is because not only is it there's like this testing phase that needs to happen there. But you, for me, it was suddenly like this huge fear because you were like further along in your, in your, like healing. And, and you were further along in that, and, and doing things so much better. And you weren't doing things the way that you used to do them. And yeah, it was really good. But one, I hadn't figured out my stuff yet. And so then I started to have this like, Well, I'm not good enough anymore. And you're just gonna like sail off into the sunset where you're like, perfect communication, and you're supportiveness and you're holding space, and

Curt Storring 12:48

all that stuff abandonment, because, like leveling up,

Natalie 12:51

because you had leveled up so hard, and you'd like transform so hard and become so good. And I didn't know how to do any of those things yet, or like some of them or whatever it was, I mean, well, I'm not completely useless here. You know, like, so in instances where, like, I didn't know how to do whatever it was you were doing. So I have to learn how to do this. But like, I'm actually like having this conflict right now. And I'm screaming at you, and I need to figure out how to do this. And maybe if I scream at you, it will be worse than it was before because you're not screaming at me now. And like I'm not good enough anymore. And you're gonna just like be so good that you don't, that you're like you're done, you know. So there is like that fear that could be coming up for people as well.

Curt Storring 13:35

Yeah, I think there's like a big the, the lesson here is not necessarily that it's going to be fear of abandonment. But the lesson here, I think, is that for her, you have to expect that it's going to be difficult for all of this to be going down because it's so different. You are changing her reality by changing yourself because you are such a huge part of her reality. And any change is like either going to need to be trusted by her because you know, you've broken that trust over so many years, or you're going to have to like re orient herself back to reality because you suddenly changed her reality. So like there's, there's a lot of compassion and patience that we have to have doing dad work basically, because it's changing things for our family. And even though it's for their good, even though it's going to benefit everyone, there's going to be a period where they're like, Wow, you just rocked the boat a lot and I'm pretty sure I fell in and she doesn't yet know that you can swim and that you're gonna save them and you're gonna build them an even bigger and better boat. So yeah, so anyway, the actual logistical question of how long I don't know what, few weeks few months What do you think? Because like you said, this was like a 10 year period just about

Natalie 14:47

Whoa. No, like I'm trying to like, I'm trying.

Curt Storring 14:52

I want to say it was like a bliss. I want to say it was like a three week thing where you like really tested me In terms of like things that we were talking about, you would go way harder on the conflict side. And I don't think you were like intentionally doing that. But it was like this need to trust. And if you can trust in the hardest things you can give to me, then you'll be able to relax and trust me in like the normal day to day stuff. So I feel like that lasted two or three weeks. But again, this was like after obsessively like you weren't, we were so obsessed with like fixing ourselves. I don't know if people operate on that level, but like, I treated it like a full time job. We were constantly talking about every time we'd screw up, we have a like a debrief and go, you know, my debriefs, most like, I'm an idiot, I hate myself, everything's terrible. I'm sorry for this. I just can't do anything. Blah, blah, blah. And we go through this. So like, we were always talking about it. And if you're going through this kind of stuff, like that was for us, the baseline, the core baseline is that we just talked about everything. Even if we were like, shitting the bed on pretty much everything. So I don't know. Do you have anything else on that? Um, am I miss remembering? Or do you remember other things?

Natalie 16:01

No, I think that would be pretty accurate. There was like a sort of pressure cooker phase there. Yeah. And then I because I can't specifically remember that. But I can very clearly remember like, slightly after that. Anything confrontational where like you did the thing. And then I would just realize that I wasn't doing anything horrible in response to it. And then going like, oh, we can do?

Curt Storring 16:28

Yeah, yeah. And we never having seen this before. We're like creating actual how you're supposed to be in conflict. And what was that thing that I was doing just as like a quick sidestep, to give guys like some hope, because we talked about communication formulas, we talked about setting boundaries, we talked about holding space. But what did you see in those moments of conflict that was easier to navigate.

Natalie 16:48

Um, I think it was probably the space holding because I, if I would get like super emotional, and then it previously if I would get like, super emotional, and then that would overwhelm you. And you would like, either like, throw up walls to it, or try to shut it down, or whatever it was, then that would just like, build me up. And then we would just be like, we're both like, so smart. We just like try and pick at each other and be like, Oh, it's smarter. euteller will like throwing grenades or whatever. But then, like, you do, like the space holding hand be like, yep. Okay. And then I just feel like, I can't do anything anymore. It doesn't feel good to yell at you anymore. Because you're like, angry, but you're being nice to me. Stop it. Like, I want to yell at you. But I can't anymore. There's nothing. There's no, there's no one there's no fuel. So yeah,

Curt Storring 17:38

that's a great way to put it. There's just no fuel, when like holding space to me is like listening to understand. And feeling everything you're feeling. Don't just like, totally block it. But just affirm. And empathize and be like, Yeah, I hear you, you're really upset right now. I totally get it. Like, I would feel that way too. You want me to just listen? And is there anything I can do to help? I'm just going to be here for you totally understand, and not being like, oh, no, you didn't do that. You didn't tell me that. Like I did this. Because whatever, like defensiveness and blame shifting, and just like, Can I fix it? How do I fix this because I need to go away because I was uncomfortable with your emotions. So like, that's the how and also a little bit of the why that particularly the discomfort of your emotions. Because there was a lot of people pleasing, there's a lot of nice guy nature, which is like, I needed to have everyone around me in a good mood, otherwise, it was my fault. And then I felt like a loser and a failure and all the rest of those kinds of things. So there was a little bit of that going on as well.

Natalie 18:34

But then when it diffuses like that, when it when it diffuses like that you end up realizing like your basketball because like you're you're still like you want to like you want to fight you want to fight and then like, oh, maybe maybe I shouldn't be doing that. Why am I doing this, like when you when you don't get the fuel, it gives you more of an opportunity to look at how you're behaving and how you're doing that. And the thing about this as well is that like we learned how to do like the space whole time in the communication like that with the kids before we learn how to do it with ourselves. And it's pretty similar.

Curt Storring 19:12

Okay, so trust is going to take a while but that makes sense. Those are some of the reasons behind it. Some of the reasons some of the ways that you can make it easier is just to hold that space. Listen understand like why she's feeling that way and then help to just be there for it not give the fire or not the fire not give the gas

Natalie 19:29

and if she hasn't given you the opportunity and the space to prove yourself to sort out your shit. Hopefully you can do the same for her even though she's coming at you with her like harpy daggers testing you to see like how strong you can hold it. Because it took me it took me a while to like figure my stuff out and because I was doing it after you, you you had to wait as well. You have to be patient for that.

Curt Storring 19:55

Alright, we're back from conflict resolution with the children. Okay, um, one of the other questions, we're just gonna rapid fire here, we probably have a few minutes until everyone is fed up and hungry, managing chores and work. I mean, like, I don't even know what the question here is you go to work. I'm at a church couldn't say better than that. Yeah.

Natalie 20:17

And then you, and then

Curt Storring 20:18

I do all the ones I can do to be extra Hardcore

Natalie 20:21

is gonna say, when you're like being super extra, and you do all this extra stuff on I say, You are the one who goes to work while you're doing this. And you say, because I'm just that good. And I say, and then you

Curt Storring 20:33

want to do more. And then I want to do more, everyone does more. And we just like go uphill, faster together. So like,

Natalie 20:39

yeah, yeah. And not in like a manic way. Either not I'm like, Oh, I have to like ohtori where I have to do

Curt Storring 20:44

this, like paying attention

Natalie 20:45

to you do so much. And then like, I do so much. And then you do so much. And then we just like, everything gets done more or less. And we have a good time doing it.

Curt Storring 20:57

Yeah. No, not much more. Alright, so we talk about this. Sometimes I get a question from Jonathan. If you could talk about how dropping your expectations of her while you bossed up affected her, that would be great. I love the boss stop. phrase, by the way, I'm gonna use that from now on. But I think the idea is basically like, a lot of us as husbands. We just have this like selfish mentality that if I do something for you, I need something back in return tit for tat reciprocation, like one for one, you're keeping score. And if you do something for your wife, you kind of expect something back. And that's just like, it's not sexy, and it's not intimate. And it's not the way things work. Because you should be doing things to serve your wife, because you're a good husband. And that's what you do. Now, there's obviously this whole other side where you desire to be close, you want her to want to do things for you. But when it comes to like, figuring this stuff out, and just serving sacrificially, you have to remove your so called needs, they're not needs, their desires, from the equation. And so rather than me getting pissy because like, Oh, I really want sex, and you're not giving it to me, I'm just gonna be mopey. Oh, look at all this stuff. I do want her to do this. For me. It's like, that's not attractive. It's not going to give me what I want. I spend a lot of time doing that. And so when you drop expectations, let's do the thing because it's the right thing to do when you have no more of that, like, mopey, whiny, sad, baby. Like, has that been a good thing for you to experience? Would you suggest men do this? And then I guess there's like that woman side of thing with the expectations too. This

Natalie 22:33

is a huge this is so heavily weighted on both sides. I can't answer this effectively without, like laying in on the women here because it's so so important to to hate it from both sides. So if you are giving what the expectation to receive, that's not sacrificial at all, that's not the thing that you're talking about.

Curt Storring 23:00

Right? When I was gonna make you feel if I were to do things only to receive what that's up.

Natalie 23:04

Yeah. And if I were to do things only to receive that would suck for you, too.

Curt Storring 23:08

Yes, exactly. Okay, so that's like, that's the basic question covered in terms of like, Yeah, that sucks. So not doing that is actually good, but carry on.

Natalie 23:16

Um, but then I would have to say, like your specific Napoles, like, I've washed the dishes, can we have sex now?

Curt Storring 23:25

Of course, I love it. That's awesome. But not because of that.

Natalie 23:28

Okay. Yeah. But the thing about the thing about that is that men have got to this point where they believe that the answer is always going to be no 100% the time and their wives are laughing at them for even asking, and that the wife has absolutely no, there's no expectation whatsoever for the wife to even entertain her husband's desires. And she's got absolutely no desire whatsoever, either. Because, like, she's got 100 more problems that are more important than intimacy and connection with the husband. I'm not the best person to talk about this. There's some good resources on this. But I think five should say yes, more often. I think that if you if your husband has like that deep desire for physical intimacy and connection, why don't you and I know you have a lot of answers on that, but like, honestly, most of the time, probably just feeling lazy. And if you can say yes

Curt Storring 24:40

or no, but it's so much easier to say what you're saying when the husband's not a total piece of shit. And so like I want to make very sure that I'm first talking to the husband doesn't I

Natalie 24:53

don't think this is I don't think this is a good thing because it's so so I got no it's Too much waitstaff, this question of too much wife stuff.

Curt Storring 25:03

It's literally monolithic, can't put up expectations.

Natalie 25:08

Because this is not exactly what this is. This is just dropping expectations. I mean, what does he specifically talking about expectations here? Just like what what kind of expectation? Like

Curt Storring 25:17

I do something there for you give me something. Okay.

Natalie 25:21

Because like, I would just assume that'd be like one thing, because that's like the husband wife currency is dishes for sex, right? Like that's, is that the that's that that's expectations? Or is it? Because for most guys, yeah, for most for most, most guys, then that's just the thing.

Curt Storring 25:39

Yes, the guys want the results, they want to do all this work. And then they want the results back, which is like, look at all this work I'm doing Can you just like, you know, give me some lovin, though. Yeah,

Natalie 25:49

and there should not be a like transactional exchange there. But there should also not be wives laughing of their husbands for even trying,

Curt Storring 26:06

right. And this is where you bring your wife into the conversation and you send her the podcast, and you tell her to listen to this, because

Natalie 26:12

that's true. But I'm not the person talking about that as well. You are

Curt Storring 26:17

literally talking about it, and it's work. So there you go. Why it's like it's not it's not because of it's the exact same result. But it's not because of you should want to reciprocate, because you love each other and you want to serve each other. Not because they did something for you, is there at least like a there's a nuance here, where the guys just get pissy because they're not getting any, and you should be able to handle the burden of not getting any, because that's not like the main issue here. The main issue is are you leading your family? Well, yeah. And

Natalie 26:50

it's, it's a it's a sacrificial thing on the wife's part to be like, I'm kind of tired, but like, I love you, and I want to connect with you. And I can let go of being kinda tired. Because like, is that a real reason? Like it? Because the the benefit of it is so much greater is like to have intimacy and the connection and stuff rather than being like. No. Excuses. Yeah, finding excuses. And that doesn't mean like it.

Curt Storring 27:26

Like you wouldn't have been able to do that six years ago, there's no way you would have been six years it took me Manning up or bossing up. In this case. Yes,

Natalie 27:34

it did. And I would love to do 100% other credit here. But the wife also has to do, yes, her stuff

Curt Storring 27:43

on the same track, at the same time, equally responsible to each other. There's a verse in First Corinthians seven that talks about, you know, the wife's body is not belonging to her alone, but also to the husband and vice versa. So like this get in trouble brothers know,

Natalie 27:58

it's truth. It is it is, except that there is so much information out there, so much culture out there that says, like, 100 different things, 100 different reasons, from 100 different angles as to why that's

Curt Storring 28:11

so here's the thing. Uh, maybe I bet the reason that this feels clunky right now is because we're coming at it from different assumptions. My assumption is like totally broken marriage, no communication, no intimacy guy has been shitting the bed for a long time. wife's like, man, if you only did something that would be great, and she's probably got her own problems. But always, for me talking to the guys out there has to start with you. You cannot force your wife to change, but you can lead her in that direction, by your own actions and with loving her regardless, and then sometimes setting boundaries and leading the way. Now, that being said, in a perfect world, of course, everyone's like treating each other as they want to be treated, you're selflessly doing everything, you're thinking of others greater than yourself in all things. Therefore, you're giving your body to your wife, she's giving her body to you, you're loving each other, you're building each other up. And that like dual wheel spin, ends up being like four wheel drive, or I guess dual wheel spin anyway, you know what I mean? Like you can go farther together. Because you're both on the same track. You both have like this loving, open heart, your souls are open. But when you're so bogged down by crap, when you're so in the culture, when you're so in your head when you're so hurt, like we were, I think he got to start by being the guy who just does the right thing for the right reason and dropping all expectations of reciprocation, until such point as you are, like them men, and then you can start to bring her around as well. And then, as always, her sin her issues are always her responsibility. But you can't lead with tit for tat. And I think that's like, nuanced, I think you get the same result. But I think it starts with not expecting tit for tat, because a lot of guys are just in that. So

Natalie 29:56

this is the same answer. It's more or less the same answer to the last Question on, which is like, why are you why are you fixing yourself? Are you fixing yourself? So you can be the best individual person? Or are you fixing yourself so that the relationships in your life and the most important number one relationships in your life get better? If you're doing it so that you can be cool?

Curt Storring 30:21

Look at how good I am. Yeah,

Natalie 30:23

exactly. But then if you're doing it, if you're if you're if you're making these changes, because the goal is our family's better, our marriage is better if you are dropping your expectations and serving sacrificially. Because the intent is not so that you come off as a better person, but you improve your marriage and your family. And then she's doing it if the if the intent is not selfish.

Curt Storring 30:50

Yeah, that just gets lost, though. Because you're hurting so badly. There's 100 Things that you have to fix. And then it's just like, you can't think like that, unless you're in it. But then again, maybe you just never heard that. That's how it's supposed to work. Because nobody told me that we like happened across this somehow. You know, like, nobody told us this how it's supposed to work. So if this is the first time you hearing this, this actually works. It's worked for us, worked for a lot of guys that we work with. So yeah, and I guess like the selfishness that comes into this question is, are you literally just trying to get laid? Because if you're like, Oh man, who How do I get like, okay, maybe she wants me to be different, like that is selfish. And that is not I want to be the best for my wife and kids in like the generations to come. So don't be selfish. I think that's probably an extremely convoluted conversation. But also, perhaps there's some stuff in there as well. All right, is there anything that let's say I'm like, 10 steps ahead. Like you were feeling? How could I have helped you through the period of my major transformation? Was there anything I could have done? Or did you appreciate what I did do? Is it just time? How can we help our wives through periods where we're growing, and they're like, what's going on?

Natalie 32:03

I'm consistency. I'm continuing to do the thing that you were going to do. And I don't mean, you have to do everything perfect all the time. And always, always, always get it right. But like generally just being consistent with the thing that you saw that you were going to do and doing it. The it I think it depends on like how the wife wants to be loved. But to have that affirmation, like, they yawn doing less and things are getting better. But like I'm doing this for, for me, but also like for us. So my intent here isn't to like, fix everything. And I'm ditch you. My intent is because I want our marriage and I want our family. So like there's the affirmation there and like loving your wife in the way that she wants to be loved. If you can, like be more loving or be more affirming, I hope that this lady can see the work that is happening and is then able to painfully let go of the ego that has been keeping her safe this whole time. Because that's that's really hard if you've been the wife who's been doing all the work and keeping everything together and then your husband suddenly shows up and he's like, actually, no, I'm here now I can do this. You're like, Excuse me. I'm completely exhausted and losing my hair and I'm yeah, like angry at you because I've done everything it's really really hard to let go. I don't necessarily feel like I don't feel like that was our experience. I did not feel like I was driving the boat at any point. I feel like you would

Curt Storring 33:49

just who isn't drunk pilot why no ramming people and killing all Yeah, I

Natalie 33:53

was just thinking Have you ever like driving a garbage truck that was on fire or something like that? But you were always driving it was just like

Curt Storring 33:59

yes it was yes drink driving the family vehicle.

Natalie 34:03

Yeah, so I don't feel like I had that particular experience. But I think that it would probably be very overwhelming and scary to experience that and then have to get to the point where you have to like all you have to let someone else take the lead. And that's really scary if it's been keeping you safe this whole time.

Curt Storring 34:24

All right, thanks for listening. You guys can find me at dad work dot Kurt on Instagram, you can join our free 10 Day elite dad challenge at Dad.Work slash challenge. And make sure to subscribe and leave a review because that is the best way for this to get in the more ears of more fathers. And guys that is going to literally I hope save the world because the more of fathers we impact the more children we impact more families we impact the more they have children 2040 years from now. And they have different families and different lines that we have and it all could start because you left a review and the algorithm picked it up and gave it to another man so leave a review leave a rating on spot by going to Apple the review, that's it. We'll see you here next week. Thank you for listening to the dad work podcast. That's it for this episode. But if you would like to stay in touch between weekly episodes, why don't you go over to Instagram and follow me there because I drop a number of things throughout the week that are related to what we talk about on this podcast, but usually go a little bit deeper, provide some tips you can find me on Instagram at dad work dot Kurt. That's da d w o RK dot c u r t. And please, if you have been getting something out of this podcast, if it has touched you if it has improved your marriage, your parenting or your life, would you please leave a quick review on Apple or Spotify, leave a rating. If you have a few extra seconds, leave a quick review. That's the best way that we can get this work in the hands of more fathers. And I truly believe that we change the world, one father at a time because each father that parents better that loves better raises children who do the same. And in just a couple of generations. I feel like we could be living in a world much better than the one we live in today. Your review will help along that path. And I thank you so much for being here to listen until next week. We'll see you then.