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Today’s guest is Scott Rammage.

We go deep talking about:

  • Raising teenagers and the lessons Scott has learned
  • Productivity and getting things done as a father
  • Finding or creating a tribe of men to support each other in this fatherhood journey
  • Traumas carried from our childhood into our adult life
  • Having a great dad growing up as a role model but still struggling in your journey as a father
  • Finding the right balance between work and family
  • Personal self-growth as a father and an entrepreneur
  • Commanding your day before it commands you
  • The Brotherhood of Fatherhood group for men

Scott Rammage is the co-owner of VAs For Gyms and Media Machine, a company that provides virtual admin services to small businesses and coaches. Scott is a productivity nerd and loves leveraging systems to get more done in less time.

Scott is passionate about helping men become leaders in their homes and communities and that is why he co-founded the Brotherhood of Fatherhood. A group for men to help each other step up and lead.

Scott is the host of The Brotherhood of Fatherhood Podcast, Stories That Sell Podcast, and co-hosts the Principles of Growth Podcast.

He has been married for 25 years and has two teenage boys. Scott enjoys lifting weights, rucking, snowboarding, mountain biking, and traveling with his family. 

Mentioned on this episode:

Pomodoro Timer & To Do List

Things 3 Application

You can find Scott online at:

Brotherhood of Fatherhood FB Group:



Brotherhood of Fatherhood Podcast:

Curt Storring 0:00

Welcome to the Dad.Work podcast. My name is Curt Storring, your host and the founder of Dad.Work. Today is episode 41. With Scott Ramage, we go deep talking about raising teenagers productivity and getting things done as a father finding or creating a tribe of men to support each other in this fatherhood, journey. traumas carried from our childhood into our adult life, having a great dad growing up as a role model but still struggling in your journey as a father, finding the right balance between work and family. Personal growth as a father and an entrepreneur, commanding your day before it commands you and the brotherhood of fatherhood group for men. Scott Ramage is the co owner of VAs for gyms and media machine, a company that provides virtual admin services to small businesses and coaches. Scott is a productivity nerd and loves leveraging systems to get more done in less time. Scott is passionate about helping men become leaders in their homes and communities. And that is why he co founded the brotherhood of fatherhood, a group for men to help each other step up and lead. Scott is the host of the Brotherhood of fatherhood podcast stories to sell podcast and CO hosts the principles of growth podcast. He's been married for 25 years and has two teenage boys. Scott enjoys lifting weights, rocking, snowboarding, mountain biking and traveling with his family. You can find Scott online by searching Facebook for the brotherhood of fatherhood group on Instagram at Scott Ramage, or at brotherhood of fatherhood. And you can obviously listen to his podcast which I mentioned just a moment ago, search on Apple or wherever you listen to podcasts for the brotherhood of fatherhood podcast. This is so much fun. Scott and I have a lot of synchronicities. And in fact, I really hope we will be able to work together over the coming year to put together something some programs, I'm offering some call even for our audiences, because we just yeah, we click so well here. I love this conversation. Scott is a great mix of balance, really, between getting things done, and being aware of his own inner life and being vulnerable and open to his struggles and the ways that he showed up both the good and the bad as a father and just sharing that journey. So I love this episode, I really loved meeting and getting to know Scott, I hope you will to check this out and then check his podcast out, I think you'll probably enjoy that as well. And remember, if you are enjoying this, please would you take five seconds, it could literally take five seconds. If you're in the Apple app right now scroll down on the Dad.Work podcast hit rating and you can even review it if you have more than five seconds but a rating and or review would be very much appreciated. We are really hitting the ground running here in 2022. And I would love for you to be part of it and to share this work with more men and one of the ways that we do that is by getting more reviews. So more men find it when they search for fatherhood podcasts on Apple. All that being said, let's jump into this amazing conversation with Scott Ramage.

I'm here with Scott Ramage. I'm super pumped to talk to you, man, I have listen your podcast, I know that you are doing the same sort of amazing things for dads. So first of all, thank you for coming. I know we're gonna have an awesome conversation. And yeah, just pumped to talk to you today.

Scott Rammage 2:50

Yeah, thank you, man, I do in the same listening to your podcasts. And so much of it resonates. And so much of it is like, hell yeah, this is this is the stuff that's needed for fathers. So I'm super pumped, it's really exciting for me to just align with other men who have a mission and a passion to basically feed into other men, the things that we've gone through, we've learned and we know other men need, but also a big part of that is having a tribe, for me, I mean, for you for you know, for our own growth as we continue through this thing called parenting and being an amazing partner, and just amazing person and community. So that's really exciting to meet people like you.

Curt Storring 3:31

Oh, dude, that has been the single greatest thing of this podcast is meeting people who are doing this work, who are willing to go deep, who are willing to share and be vulnerable, because just even personally, like joining a men's group, for me has been lights out the best thing I've ever done. And now it's like next level, because I'm doing these things with guys like you who are leading now. And so like this is a sort of a meta conversation about what it takes to extend to other men while being a leader of those men and of your community. So yeah, I'm glad that we're on the same page there. And I think there's probably a lot of work to be done together and getting a group together like that. And as I often do, I want to start with your journey through fatherhood. Because like I've shared countless times by now, everyone knows he's listening that like my journey was miserable. Like, I did such a bad job because I was hurting so bad. And it really led me down this path of self development and healing. And so for all of that, I'm so grateful. And I'm just curious, like, was fatherhood something that was like planned, easy came to you naturally or were there struggles along the way?

Scott Rammage 4:36

I completely sucked when I started 100% I think I think that's a really unique thing is we all have our own story. Right? And so for me, I don't know that I was intentional and intentionality is you know, intentionality is a key to so many things, but I was young. I had been married to my wife for some time we did a lot of ventures and traveling together previously. to kids, so it was her and me and living this life together and pursuing our careers. And what happened was, I just went into it blind and just immediately went into a sucker zone. I mean, I don't know if there's a nice way to put it, but I wasn't prepared to do what I needed to do. And a lot of that pivoted around a misalignment of what a dad does, which is crazy. Curt, I was telling you earlier, you know, I want to speak to some men out there that maybe wonder why they're struggling with being a dad, I have had and have the most amazing relationship with my father. And he was an outstanding role model. He actually did things right. He had his values in order, he spent time with his family very intentionally. He still built a business on the side, he had his moral compass right on and he was leading us in the direction he thought was best. He was absolutely loving on my mother and, and cared for her and worked with her. I mean, like, I had the childhood, other than probably money. And I don't know if that would have helped it or not, but I had the childhood that everybody wishes they ever guy wishes they had that dad to take you hunting teach you how to shoot. No pressure, though. Be involved with your sports, if you enjoyed it, if you didn't, okay, no problem. built me a halfpipe in the backyard, because I was really into skateboarding. And I was rather good at it. So instead of me going somewhere, he's like, Let's build one here. So I spent an entire summer with him. That's the kind of dad I had. And I think what happened is I just took that for granted. And I know there's other men out there that have great fathers and are struggling because I struggled. But I was so nonchalant. And not I didn't see the forest for the trees. I didn't know I was a crappy father. You know, I was just drifting. And that's, that's a that's a term I absolutely love. I've heard you talk about it. But there was, I just was a victim of drift. And I was just immersed in all these things other than being an amazing husband and an amazing father. So there you go, I suck. You know, I pattern I found Curt. I mean, I'm, I'll be curious over time, as you interview more and more men, you've already interviewed quite a few. If you notice this pattern, too. As I've interviewed hundreds of men, something I found with a lot of them that struggled, that are entrepreneurs is that they began there. They like their entrepreneurial, like switch went up 10 notches, as soon as they had their first kid, this is a really interesting pattern I've noticed. So I have my first kid, he's on the way, I'm a full time educator in public schools. And I have a summer job because since what I've always done, and here comes my first son, and I'm like, Good idea, let's start a business. I'm not only going to start a business, I'm also going to maintain my my career as a full time educator, which for an entrepreneur, for that kind of mind is not a good career, by the way, but I love doing it. But it was it was very limiting. So I took on a career right before my firstborn was born and just drove myself like literally looking back at it, I would get up at 4am, I would go to I owned a bike shop at the time, I'd go to the bike shop, do a bunch of the business work, maybe get in a workout, bike ride, whatever it was at that time, go home shower, go to work. So I was home for like 15 minutes, go to the school, after school, go directly back to my business and work in my business until 789 o'clock at night. This is with newborn dude. I was a loser.

But, you know, I did that for five years. And when my second born, oh, there was one now and now I have two kids and my wife is basically doing life on her own. And she's phenomenal. And we were best friends for so long. And we're so amazing, amazingly connected. And she was just wonderful. During that time, she kind of just kind of drifted to she just kind of was in this like pattern like okay, you've heard the statement where you have these, an airplane one degree off from from destination will end up 1000s of miles from where it's supposed to go. We were in one degree off. We were both moving in different patterns really parallel but barely out of parallel. And I lifted my eyes up five years and it's like holy crap. I'm like every free moment I'm out riding with my buddies in the name of building the business. I'm out doing bike bike riding with groups doing all these things racing traveling all over the place, working every hour of the day and I thought it was just such an amazing dad thing to take them to my business and let them hang out which was Boo that's not good. I mean, it's good if it's, you know, in in moderation. And there's just a day I came home from work and 2008 or 2009 it was nine o'clock house was pitch black. There was a table no food on it but a table or a plate, no food on it on the table. No one was awake. And at that moment was I like literally got bitch slapped in the face like, Dude, you are doing this wrong, like you've had zero connection with your family today. So that was the start of kind of a realization for me. And the story gets quite crazy after that. But yeah, so in the name of building a better future for my family, I totally ignored. Yeah,

Curt Storring 10:20

and I relate so hard to that, like, I quit my job, right, as we found out, we were my wife was pregnant, moved 1000 kilometers to be closer to family. And I was like, You know what the most responsible thing to do right now is to realize I'm never getting another job. And I don't have a business plan. I'm not going to do anything else. And it's like, obviously, I'm joking. That was the least responsible thing I could have done. But I went full in to building a business. And it was the same sort of thing like 14 hour days, never doing anything annoyed when anyone would knock on my office door to come in. Because I worked at home. And just like, man, every little thing, I didn't set boundaries around it. And so I would rage and I would yell and I would be bullied. And I would be shameful. And like, there was nothing there was just me building a business because I thought this is what you do you build a business to support the family. And like that's good enough. And it wasn't good enough, because I just hurt all the time. And so just before we get like further on into your story, I'm curious. What do you think it was about? Like your dad being so good, that still allowed you to think like, you're complacent? Almost like was it too easy? Because it looked easy? From your father's perspective?

Scott Rammage 11:27

I think so. I think so I think you nailed it on the head. I mean, he was just good. And he connected so well. And what I learned later is he was super intentional about it, he would go he would come home from work. I don't think it was ever later and 5pm. Even though he owned his own business, it was never later than 5pm. And he would kiss my mom, give her a little attention. And then he would come straight to us. And he now tells me like every day, I had physical time with you. We were rolling on the ground wrestling. And it was from I can remember this all the way up until like college I've photos of my dad and I doing like Indian league wrestles or wrestling, which is I don't know if that's politically correct anymore. But doing physical things being there. You know, he was at least not like an overbearing guy. He just would roughhouse and play and listen and talk and be interested in what I was interested in. And I don't know why that I was a miss from that. I think it's this misalignment of I want, maybe it was the money thing, you know, they we grew up pretty tight. And I didn't want to be that way. And I just felt this pole to just go make tons of money and do these things. So it's a really good question. I think I'm still on the Journey to Understanding that. But looking back, he laid such an freakin incredible foundation for many still just a phenomenal person in my life. So for me to, to kind of screw up. It's funny, because even talking to other people, they didn't think I was screwing up, I did a really good job, you know, from the outside looking in, everything was great, right? When it was birthday time I was there. And but my mind was not so for a few examples. Halloween, and we had this downtown Halloween parent parade. And instead of like putting my family first my boys were little they dressed up and they could be in this pray get a lot of candy and I my business was right downtown where this was happening. I invited a rep to come and visit visit my business and and because I knew I was gonna get a bunch of bunch of free swag. And I'm like, you know, and my wife's like, we're gonna do this. I'm like, Okay, you guys go out, I got this responsibility. Just my alignment of my, my thoughts. And my priorities were so screwed up. And then Christmas day someone called like, I want to buy my kid a bike now, I left the family Christmas thing and went to the business to sell a bike. That's the kind of stupid stuff I was doing. But I was there for Christmas. So I was winning big points, right. But I didn't see, like I said, the forest for the trees. I could not, I could not see my, my fallacies at that point. And man, it's just lit a fire under me, as I've kind of gotten along in life and looked back and reflected and done a lot of learning and insert introspection and some fixing on myself. I'm like holy cow. Men need to know these things before they need to be able to see what they're doing and intentionally do what they need to do. And be given the guide and the support. So they don't do that and make that mistake like you and I did and so millions of men do every

Curt Storring 14:24

year. Yeah. And it's not unusual. And like there's a lot of guilt that goes along with men and dads were like, oh, man, I screwed up. And I felt that for a long time. And it's normal. Like nobody taught us you had a great role model, but I'm sure you weren't physically taught like, here's how you be a dad. You just sort of pick it up along the way. And then you have a kid and you're just supposed to you know, figure it out along the way. One question I have is like beyond the money thing, and this could just be yet but did you along your own journey realize any like perceived traumas. So this is the thing we talk about a lot is like your dad could have been perfect, but there could have been this perception that like, Oh, I'm not good enough because you didn't do this one thing with me have you had to heal through any of that, or, like I said, it could just be the money thing, which you already touched on.

Scott Rammage 15:10

So not that I can remember. And, and I have gone through a lot of work. But what I've noticed and come full circle around is almost all of those traumas for me, were school based. They were in middle school, middle school, and elementary man, high school was a breeze for me, I just had a great time I finally kind of clicked but middle school and elementary were just hell. And that's probably why I became a teacher, like, I just didn't want to be that person. And it wasn't until I went back, visited those stories in my head, wrote them out, and then talked with someone through them and actually reframed. What does that mean, what did that experience do for me and took that this happened to me and change that this happened for me. And then I realized I started connect the dots. Like, I probably became a teacher because of those experiences. And because I became a teacher, I actually know how to work with people at a different level I can I have a different skill set, because I've mastered screen education. So I got all this. So I start to connect the dots. And then I become thankful for everything that's happened, right? And so try childhood trauma. Sure, there's some, you know, stories out there. But I look back now I'm like, yeah, it was a jerk. I got in trouble. That's my problem. But, you know, maybe I'm different that way. But I haven't uncovered anything. And I've done a lot of work in that area.

Curt Storring 16:26

Beautiful. Yeah. No, thank you for sharing that. This is I just I love this part of it, where you get the stories and like more and more guys are going to be like, Oh, I relate. And then they can pick up the thread of what you did next. And so let's get to that you come home, you see this dinner table dinner table, you got to play. There's nothing on it. Everyone's Asleep. What happened next? How did you go about fixing this?

Scott Rammage 16:46

I literally sat my wife down. I don't know if it was with a day or two days or whatever, and said, I'm sorry, I screwed up. And something's got to change. And it was the first time she looked at me. She's like, Yeah, I mean, yeah, you do. So great. Here's what I did, I found a buyer for my business because it was a very viable great business, I had a in retail businesses, one of the ways that they operate is they operate on like a credit cycle. So for us, we'd order bikes in you know, winter that come in, in spring, or I don't remember the cycle. But we were right at that point. So I was getting all this inventory, and it was hundreds of 1000s of dollars, we're big, we're big shop, hundreds of 1000s of dollars inventory. And I'm like, okay, and we hadn't paid for it yet. Great Business paying us money, but you know, supporting us for extras. And so like, I'm going to sell it because it's a great turnkey for somebody just to come in, boom, I can put my attention in my wife in the reason I decided to sell the business instead of let go of education. So I got a lot of affirmations from both but education, I was winning awards, I was in this place where you know, I I was able to do some really cool things. And then I talked to some people they were in the box people are like don't do business, you know, you'll have a consistent paycheck do teaching. So this does relate to the story. But so I literally said okay, we're gonna sell it. So I found a buyer. And about two months it was really quick process went through all the legal stuff, 11th hour 2,009/11 hour, literally, he backs out, I have sold no inventory. I have done nothing to plan for. Like, what if this falls through. And instead of like saying, Okay, I'm going to swallow my pride and say I'm going to stay open, I'm going to swallow my pride and take on a quarter million dollars of debt overnight. And I literally did I still shut down on date. I kept all the inventory paid for a place to store it and sell it very, very slowly. But I'm so selfish at this time, so I'm sure I sold it and bought more bike parts for myself who knows. But um, so a quarter million dollar and date like our debt overnight, which is a whole nother stress. So here's the thing, I made a massive change, but I hadn't done any work on myself. So I went into dark depression, really bad depression, weight gain, my friends dissipated because I was no longer there hookup for bikes, I realized who my real friends were.

life changed dramatically. And I was in I was in my own personal hell. And it took about a year and one it was New Year's Eve 2011. So almost 2012 like two years later. And you know, I have time with my kids. I have time with my wife, but I don't know how to be a dad. I don't know how to be present. My brain is just spinning out of control. And then I start doing more and more bike rides and start filling it with things that aren't fulfilling. And I just got to a point where I thought I need I thought my depression was weight based because I gained a bunch of weight. So I looked for a quick weight loss. I was like, quick weight loss. I didn't care if I had to do illegal drugs. I didn't care I wanted to lose weight. This is like where my headspace was at. And this is kind of a funky story. I found an MLM I did not know anything about MLM I did not know about direct sales. But that moment absolutely changed my life and here's why. Is because I reached out Within a day, I stepped into a business, I had no idea. I immediately started losing weight and getting in shape. But most importantly, they absolutely, like, pushed me into self development. Like that was the whole focus. So I have so much to be thankful for that experience. You know, so many people have so many negative things to say about MLM direct sales. For me, it was like, hear, you need to be immersed in self help, I went to conferences, I was listening to books finally hadn't done any self. And I just went on this like six year like, in depth development thing, but there's only so much you can consume. And then you kind of get full and you're not moving forward. And so as a result of this self help, I started to be more intentional with my wife, our our, our relationship really started to sprout and grow back to what it was before and get even better. And we started working with other couples, it was just like this phenomenal thing. I made a lot of money. By the way, it was very successful. I was able to retire from teaching which I got really sick and tired of after quitting the the bike shop and realizing, holy cow, there's no personal development in the education world, I'm sorry, educators. But it just I'm like, and I'm, I'm a sore thumb. And there are a blank sheet because I'm all talking about leadership, I'm teaching and leadership class, I'm making waves at the school and it makes other teacher made other teachers really uncomfortable. Really young guy, this guy's doing everything different than the way we're supposed to do it. So I eventually walked out on that. And then so you know, I just went on this personal journey, it was all on my own. A few people were kind of supportive, but it was, quite frankly, their whole goal to get me to learn and be better person was to earn more money, you know, they wanted me to be better, because they knew I would earn more money, which would in turn, help their business grow. I don't have a problem with that, that business model until it becomes about money. And so I went through that, but yeah, that's where I really started to lean into, like, who Scott and where's he screwed up? And it's time to take personal responsibility for it. And learn Okay,

Curt Storring 22:02

right. Okay, that is Man, what a gift to have sort of just fallen into this. And then it be what you needed and, and maybe didn't work forever. But like, there's so many lessons in there. And I one thing you said was, you get so full of all this work. And I have experienced this because I used to get up to meditate to stretch to go to the gym to do breath work to journal like I just crushed all my self help, like internalize whatever it was, and I just crushed it. You know, it was Go Go Go and get stuff done. And it wasn't until I learned about integration, which is really like sitting and doing nothing. And just like letting all of the feelings catch up, that like things finally started to land with me. And so that's one thing that I love to talk about. Do you want to maybe go there with what that looked like for us? Like, what was this point where it's like, okay, I'm full. Now one.

Scott Rammage 22:51

Yeah, this is really good. Because I went from self development to building teams to what happened, by the way is I outgrew my own leadership, when in the business, I hit a lid, I hit my own lid, you know, Matt Maxwell talks about this. And I hit it, and I knew about it, but I didn't. I was so cocky and successful. So fast. I didn't know it. And it basically just absolutely caught me off. Nice. Like business was like I had recurring revenue from that for a long time, years. But it just thought I had hit my lid. And I'm like consuming materials consuming materials, but I'm not doing I'm not integrating. I'm just it's all head knowledge, right. And I reached a spot where I needed to surround myself with people that were really going to actually take me to the next level. So I hit a wall. And I paid dearly financially for that. Absolutely. I mean, it definitely halted my continued growth financially. And it's funny because then I reverted. So I found another job another career, and started doing some corporate level, sales, training and court, I ran a customer service department and then I got recruited work in the fitness industry. They were all about self development. So I moved it over to professional growth. So I'm like, Okay, I capped out on personal growth and move it over professional growth. And this not too many years ago, I'm learning I'm learning, I'm learning and I'm getting better and better at my job. I'm doing all these things and making waves. And I heard a podcast, and I heard somebody say, like something about stop reading so many books, and just stop consuming and start doing and it was that moment, boom. I started listening to some podcasts and I started learning some actual action steps and things that I was completely missing. And that's where the lid just blew off. That's where what I'm doing now was born. That's where I really stepped into really figuring out my own operating system. And I think you kind of have an operating system based on like some morning routines and some other things. I'll talk about more More about that later. But I started to stop reading books to read books and started And then I swiveled back into this personal development like, Okay, I have some mindset problems here, what's going to help me with that I'm going to find somebody to talk to, which was a game changer for me has what I want in that department. And then when I read a book, I'm not going to stop reading that book, until I've gotten what I want out of it. And I've mastered that, by the way, that really slows down your reading. You go from like, 30 books a year to like five. And once I started doing that, my life, absolute business, accelerated relationship accelerated. Being a dad accelerated everything, everything was wrapped into these actual putting these things into practice, as opposed to just consuming. So it's a long journey.

Curt Storring 25:46

Yeah, there's a quick question I want to touch on before we get into sort of going from being alone that you said, You're doing all this work by yourself starting talking to people and we get the brotherhood of father. So before we get there, I want to learn a little bit about like, how do you read because I love this kind of stuff, like getting the most out of the materials you're reading. And I've experienced something similar, which is like, okay, slow down and integrate what you know, I use this tool called Read wise, which takes all of my Kindle highlights, and it sends me a daily email in the morning of five random highlights. So I continue to get it like in my brain trigger these memories of the book, but like, what does reading look like for you these days,

Scott Rammage 26:21

so good. It's so good. So I do a lot of audible. And that is because I spend a lot of time walking. And that's kind of part of my meditation is in walking. And I have since changed by my morning routine has changed over time. But what I will do is I'll, I'll get a book on Audible, and I'll listen to it. If it resonates with me, I'll get the hardcopy. I'll read the hardcopy, and I'll do the audible. And I will do it until you know a really good example. One of the first ones was obstacles way by Ryan Holiday, where I just needed to get how I saw obstacles into perspective. And it like it was like, boom. And so I'm like reading, reading, listening, listening, listening, reading, reading. And then there's a time when I'm like, I've got this, like, I've got this. And then if I ever find like I'm struggling in that zone, that area, which is very minimal, I'll go back. So I've had to stack very slowly. And it you know, one book, instead of taking me a couple of days, or three days or a week, now can take me a month or two months. But I'm carrying so much forward. But quite honestly, I haven't done a hack like that. And I'm very interested. That sounds phenomenal. But what's happened since now is negative part of that is that I have really high expectations for books. And you will find after a while that they all repeat. They're all some that a lot of them have the same kind of the same thing. It's just wrapped in a different package. And so I became a become a little it's just been a struggle for me, because I'll start books, I'm like, nope, same thing. And so I'm having to really, actually, it's been wonderful, actually because I've really stepped out and I finally like stepped into Outwitting the Devil and I'm like, holy cow, like holy cow next level. I've got to get some things down here. And then and then there's been a few since then. Like, the vol I can't think of his last name, but navall Yeah, and he has his whole series on Spotify. And it was like, just another level, right? Like, okay, wow, I'm sitting there, take I take notes, I do quotes, I come back and I revisit those and I reflect on them, meditate on them, and make sure that I'm where I need to be based on the things I'm learning from those. So that's kind of how I've done it. It's just much slower consumption at this point.

Curt Storring 28:47

I love that man. And this is inspiring me to maybe change my reading habits and just get more intentional. You know, you mentioned a couple bucks the obstacles the way and Outwitting the Devil I think that's Napoleon Hill, if I'm not mistaken. Are there a couple of others like just top levels just to share here before we jump back into the the other stuff? Yeah, I'm

Scott Rammage 29:04

looking over here. Of course, there's all this you know, all the standard ones like How to Win Friends and Influence. I really like high performance habits by Brendon Burchard, The Four Hour Workweek, I'm really into productivity. So if there's going to be something productivity, I'm like all over it. So four hour workweek, those types of books, skis, by pause here, I'm looking it there's just, there's just so many. It's hard for me. At the beginning of my, at the beginning of my journey, the first author that I really got into, was in I want to encourage us for men who haven't done the book thing, because there can be a transition from like not to getting into it. Do someone super interesting. Andy Andrews is an author and a speaker, who tells stories like just you wouldn't believe he reads all of his own books. And so the noticer was when I did like eight times I first heard and I and I went and started watching his YouTube videos. And he tells story about butterfly effect. And he tells a story about Joshua Chamberlain and how he actually completely changed the course of the United States. Like, all these little things that happen that you don't know about in history that had a massive effect. So he's a storyteller, and you can learn so much the noticer, the travelers gift. So it's an it's all encompassing. And that's a really great, great way to start. So I would be it I cannot neglect the power of really great storytellers who are using amazing figures in history, and teaching really incredible lessons that are applicable right away. So those are, those are some I can't, I can't leave, I can't leave out and then Andy Andrews, kind of an odd doc, he's, he's definitely southern. He had a new book out bottom of the pool, and I'm doing that one. Now. I was like, I've heard everything from him. I know what he's going to teach about, oh, my gosh, it blew my mind. This is totally different spouse thinking completely different about approaching things from a completely different angle. And he's telling stories in there. It's totally engaging. So that's the one I'm doing right now. And so it's a constant journey for me. But basically, when people say, this book really changed my life, like, Yeah, I mean, I've read way too many books.

Curt Storring 31:19

Yeah, I'm in the same thing. I have like lists from the past five years of all the books, I've read with notes on them. And I go through those and go like, this changed my life. This changed my life. This changed my life. And what you said, and this is one of the things that I think I see like at my kids school, sometimes it basically says, Read what you love until you love to read. Yes. So I love that you brought that up. Because like, yeah, for a lot of men who haven't read or haven't made the time for it, just start with something that's like, oh, yeah, I would love to know about that. And then you develop the habit. So yeah, thanks for sharing the actual books. I think that's super actionable. I've got a ton I'll probably talk about at some point in another podcast, but I want to transition now from being alone, and doing the work with other people's and talk to people into this creation of the Brotherhood of fatherhood, and everything else you're doing today. So I'd love to hear a little bit more about that. And then we'll dive back into productivity, because this is definitely something I want to talk to you about. So what did that look like when you started to sort of lead and question and do the work with other men?

Scott Rammage 32:14

Yeah, so in is seven years ago, whatever that date was, haven't done the backwards about 2015. Maybe. I had a business in Oregon, where I was from where all my family was added two blocks from my in laws, two bucks for my parents big dream, our dream home 2000 Or a night 1911. Home, we were the third owner, it was craftsmen, it was huge. All this support around us and I sold my gym, we had a successful gym, my wife and I and we moved to Texas to get our kids in a better schooling situation before my oldest was going into middle school. So I had the support around me. I didn't have my dad was always great, very supportive. But I didn't have men in my life who were pushing me. I desired it. I desired it so deeply. But all those men were from the business from the MLM business, and I never I had some, like, I don't, I don't I'm not good enough to be part of that group. So I had some work to do there. So we move we move to Texas. I you know, we're living off of this company that we tapped into and built a business out of, and I'm not working, and I get bored. And then then I start to question what is what am I doing? Like, what is in it for me? What am I what impact Am I making? Where am I going right now? I was bored to death. I took a corporate job after trying teaching again, which I was like no, not doing this. And I took a corporate job. And that was basically a three year plateau. Personal Learning was not occurring, I was just engrossed in working and doing everything wrong. Not being a good leader. And I finally got out of that and stepped into this fine fitness business. And realized that I had learned a lot in my life, I started to step back into this personal growth, and I stepped it up. And what that did to me was made it apparently obvious that I needed other people in my life to go to the next level. And I met somebody who's now one of my my business partner, Josh. And he started asking me questions and just mentoring. I was mentoring him and Parenthood because I had, like, all these things I'd done wrong. He was young, you know, young kids. So I'm mentoring and parents that he's mentoring me and self growth and the way I saw the world. And I remember just like, go and walk so I'd be just pissed. Like, I don't have a group of man, I'm so thankful for these people. I don't have my dad around me anymore. I don't have these people. I'm used to around me anymore, even though they weren't really pushing me for growth. It was still people around me. I was missing a tribe. Absolutely. And I was watching reading, or excuse me listening to all the podcasts, you know, looking at Ryan McClure and his group and all these guys doing these amazing things just absorbing now, like The tribe of men, and just was in me, I don't want to join someone else's, I want to create my own. And that was in me for about two years, it was just like that. I don't know how to do it, but I don't know what to do. I don't know how to do it. And talking with Josh, one day, we're just like, he's like, You've helped me so much. We need to start this thing. And then he texted me that night brotherhood of fatherhood. That's it. That was it was born. And the whole idea, the whole thing was, I have all this stuff I've learned. And I have amazing my boys, they're, they're teenagers. Now. I'm so far ahead of everybody I know, everybody I hang out with and my circle, they're younger. How do I teach people and keep them from going through the mistakes that I went through? Well, like, either tap into somebody else's and try to get other people to come in or create your own. And for me, I've always been a creator. So we created the brotherhood of fatherhood and started a podcast and just kind of been clon through what this means and what are what what we're going to do with it. And I just fell in love with podcasting, connecting men with men like you and hopefully hoping that the stories and the knowledge and the things that we talk about, because they are so incredibly important, are saving men, you know, the struggles and the pains that we went through. That's, that's the whole goal. For me. It's just like, let's smooth this path a little bit for some some people that need it,

Curt Storring 36:25

man, well, thank you for doing that work. I know, that's exactly the same thing that I'm going through here with with Dad.Work. It's like, I spent every single moment of my life as a father for years. And then 1000s of dollars, and then 1000s of hours. And then nobody was there for me until I made it myself basically. And like had to go out and find a community. And I don't wish that on anybody. And it's a message of hope. Like you've got through it. You teach men you lead men, I got through it. I'm starting to do that myself. And finding a brotherhood is like, probably like I said, it already, like the best thing that I've ever done with like a men's group and a community on the same like, I don't want to join a group. I want to make a group my own. Yeah, just because, you know, that's, that's how I'm wired to. So like, what do you have any next steps for that? Are there ways for men to join? I'm sure we'll go through this. Yeah, I guess is where to find you. But

Scott Rammage 37:16

it's really it's been really interesting, because we tried to do a coaching thing, but we just didn't have the right vision like it was this thing had to kind of grow and move. And what happened when we first started this, I just started interviewing what I called my legacy project, I interviewed fathers that I knew that had done a really good job had who had produced great adults. And that's what I think parenting is it's not raising kids. It's producing future great adults, right? We want them to come into society be amazing. Parents be amazing leaders. And that's, that's really how I tick. So I wanted to talk to all these. So I did a ton of interviews, I didn't even record them. Like I was crazy. I was just going as taken notes and doing this thing. And I'm learning, learning, learning and turn into then I started doing podcasts, which was kind of just talking to fathers about anything. And then over the last year, it's just completely pivoted into, like men like you like what can we what exactly can we help other men with? What's your story? And why does it matter? And what can other men grow from that. And what happened from the Brotherhood is I needed so many resources. Because I was working full time trying to block out time for my family and trying to make something out of brotherhood, that I actually fell into a business with my business partner, we we found some resources, we realized, whoa, this is a big problem. We plugged it into the niche that we knew, which was fitness. And it created this amazing businesses growing fast and furious. And that was less than a year ago. So all of my business focus, my business force, my tactical and operational skills and knowledge have all gone into that business. While brotherhood I've just completely been running on passion. And interviewing men, that's really been the focus over the last year. And the beginning of the Brotherhood was we want to have a tribe of men, but we want to bring them together. That was like a picture in my head. So like, this morning, spent an hour with two other men, one of them my business partner about our very first event. So for us, it's just about a tribe for men a place for them to plug in online. And then bringing them together and giving them resources like giving them knowledge and thing like guys like you come in and talk to them and teach them what you know, that's kind of what we're looking at where there's all these wonderful things out there for men there. There's, you know, your men's group, there's, you know, coaching programs, there's things that you and I needed earlier that are out there and so it's like a mission of mine to plug men into those so that's really what Brotherhood is. It's more of like we're going to be this conduit we're going to be this place where we're the podcasts obviously lives and and we're connecting with amazing men But we're giving men resources were first, I would hope that I'm exposing to the fact that they need help. And that by using other people, whether it's a group, whether it's individual coaching, whatever, there's so many different ways to do this, that they can accelerate their growth as a father, and as a man. And that so I know that sounds weird, but it's really more to be conduit. That's where we fall in. And it's a really wonderful way to go, because we get to stick with where we're passionate, which is bringing them together. And then other guys need to get to stick with where they're passionate. And that's like you like, let's get guys into your group, like, yes, the more guys we can get into your groups, the happier I'm going to be, because the more of us are going to come out of the woodworks. And the more we're going to actually change the trajectory of what a man in the household looks like, in the next 1020 3040 50 years.

Curt Storring 40:53

And it's going to change the world. Like that's, I've come to believe that that's 100% we change all the problems of the world by helping dads heal themselves do the work with other men, they pass on better things to their kids, their kids have better tools, the communities their kids build 2040 years from now, man, it's just gonna be so much better. Have you just, curiously, have you had your dad on your podcast?

Scott Rammage 41:14

You know, I haven't, which is a really interesting thing. Because I've really gone back and forth. I don't know if he would want to never asked him. But I don't know if he'd want to. And I'm just doing him a disservice by not asking him I'm thinking this right now. I really should have him on. One thing I know about my dad, he doesn't think he did a good job. He thinks his kids are phenomenal. And they did that he they came out great. I don't think he necessarily tributes that to himself. And so maybe the conversation would be really good. Just so he knows. Right? So it's been something I've been pushing around for a while. And maybe it's something personal that I need to work through. But it's a really good question.

Curt Storring 41:51

Okay, well, I encourage you to do that. I can't wait to listen to the episode. Okay, let's let's with our last little bit of time, you're talking about productivity habits, getting things done. I've had a friend of mine, Clint Murphy on who gave us this incredible goal setting structure. And I want you to sort of fill in the gaps around that with productivity and habits. So you have a saying that you told me the first time we talked which started with command the day, you want to maybe just start there and and go for however long we have left here.

Scott Rammage 42:20

Yeah, so I've always been a doer. So if I'm going to build a business, I'm going to do everything myself, I'm going to figure it out, I'm going to create, I'm gonna build the systems, but I always did everything right. And so when I started working with this fitness startup, they're like, Scott, you get everything done, but you never stopped working. So I'm committing to another business, you know, 7080 90 hours of my week, and they had a problem with that. They're like, that's no way to live your life. And I really, really respect them. Nathan holiday was the guy who really kind of dug that in to me, he said, you need to, you need to learn how to how to how to be more productive, but also how to stop. And that's, so I've always had these goals, right, that was in place, but I didn't have a system in place. So over two years, he taught me some some foundational things. And since then I've kind of put together this personal operating system. And this personal operating system includes, it starts the minute I wake up until the minute I go to bed. And there's a lot of intentional things that happen every single day. And I have built a system. And I use actually use an app, but I built a system. It'll so this is a really great analogy. For people like you and I that have a lot of we are entrepreneurs, I think a lot, you know, got a lot to do, things are coming and going built a system. This is how Nathan explained it. To me, it's like this hovering machine behind you. It's literally it's like a drone.

Drone. Yeah, right behind you just kind of hovering. And you can take anything that's in your mind and just throw it back and just throw it back. And that machine catches it and stores it for you. So that when it's the right time, you can you can get a hold of it. So what what this process has done is allowed me to have my random stream of consciousness going. So if I'm in the middle of work, what used to happen is I would work and then I'd stopped because I did this other idea. And I go over and I do this. And then I do this and I lose track. And it just take me more time to do everything task switching can reduce your productivity up to 80%. And so I had to figure out a way to stop task switching and this was this personal system. So it's called first thing you do is capture any idea any email, any text, any message, any thing to do that you have to do goes into this machine, which is an app for me. It's got an inbox, everything falls into that inbox, everything. Emails are forwarded their book lists are forwarded there. They all go into this one thing. Then I take every day and I go through that big list and I assign a date to them if I need to get them so I put them in order. And then the next day I've Got this thing that's in front of me of these are the things you need to get done. Of course, they use a calendar blocking. So blocks of time at work time, I use what's called pomodoros Pomodoro. Those are 25 minutes of like completely no interruption work, and then five minute break. It's a structure that's really, really productive. And I'll just pound through that list. And if I get done with the list, I can go back to my inbox and find what needs to go next. Here's the beauty of having an inbox for everything that comes into your head. 50% of it is BS. And I used to act on everything. So I remember I, we had a meeting and these guys were like, we need to do this. I took that and I stopped all my other work and finished it in a day and sent it to them. Like, and they're like, Okay, thanks. A week comes by, Hey, guys, what do you think, whatever another week comes by, we're never gonna use that Scott, we it was just, we were just thinking out loud. So I wasted so much of my life, you know, 80 hours a week of work. And when I got that figured out, I was able to crush it. Like just not spending time on things that I didn't need to do. Now there's a lot of it took me two years to fill, figure this out. And, and I have coached some people through it, it's been earth shattering form. It's not a service I provide. Sometimes I do like free rabbit webinars on how to do it. And But literally, it's a system. So it's capture, organize, execute, revisit rebatch. Like you're just recycling this stuff over and over again. But in that system, I built out what my morning routine is what I do the second I wake up what I do in the evening, so even when I'm walking out of my office, it tells it prompts me to say, I have an out loud, what can I do now to best serve my family? What does that do for me, shuts off work, boom, okay, shutting off work is how I can best serve my family, I can be 100% eyes on them. So just by Systemising that so that when I walk out this door, that little thing comes up, it's the same time every day, I don't always end work on that. But then I'll look at that close, close my day. Oh, and I'll say that out loud. And I'll go do my thing. And it's been massively or shattering changing. But what I've done is I've also read another massive, great book is atomic habits. And, you know, I think that's James clear, that taught me to start, use habit stacking and just take little steps and build out systems. So I have a system for in the morning I have I have a value ladder. So my values are in an order. And I make every decision and do everything based on that order. And so for me, like my wife comes before my kids, because I had my wife before I had my kids. And that's something I talk very passionately about. So when a decision comes up, am I doing this or this, I look at that value ladder, and I'm like, I need to make this decision based on what's best for my wife. And usually what's best for my wife is best for my kids. I've got that, you know kind of dialed in. So I have the first thing I do is go through a list of thing, I go through a list of audible reading of that value ladder and like affirmation statements so that every day I'm starting with that, then I do actions based on that value ladder. If, if my faith is first, the first thing I do is faith based. The second thing I do is get up, I kiss my wife, girl hug tell her lover. The third thing I do is I make sure I connect with my kids, then I go do some fitness and then so it's my whole day is in an order of the values that I have. And so what came to mind, what you were saying is I believe that you either command your day or your day will command and so I built these systems into place based on my needs at the time. And then I put them into this personal operating system so that I operate like a machine. here's the here's the bad part about this is I became so efficient. And this is not to brag, but when I quit working for this fitness company, they hired five people to replace me. And so that was

I realized that I was getting so efficient, but I was giving them so much still where I could have been giving some of that to my family. So there's some been some real learning through that as well. But I don't believe that anybody should go through their day without some sort of plan in way to execute at your absolute best so that you can give your absolute best to your family when they are in the house and around.

Curt Storring 49:24

Yeah, man, this is making me want to have you back on just for like this specific thing. That there's a gun. I bet there's just a ton in here. Is there like a name for that app? Or did you build it for yourself?

Scott Rammage 49:35

No, I did not build it for myself. And this is all based on GTD getting things done. And super boring, dry book super boring. But that structure was all built built with pen and paper and files and there's been GTD apps built and what the one I used it use is called things things three, it's an it's an Apple product, and then I've coached other people who don't have apples they use to do list But those tools I've even taught my kids in life, this, those tools you capture, everything comes in your mind. Even if you're not using the whole tool, I would challenge every man to find a digital way. Because you always have a digital with you, right? Find a digital way to capture all of your thoughts. Because your brain is like a computer with tabs open. And any open thought is another tab. And if you know anything about computers that each of those are running with some random access memory in the background. And there's a point where your brains just mush, and you get the spinning wheel of death. Because there's so many things going on in there, especially for someone like me, well, by being able to capture it and know I'm going to go back to it later, I'm not talking about a to do list, I'm talking about a place to capture stuff and then organize it from there. Without that you're keep opening tabs. And that's like you're not functioning the way you need to function. So I can remember a gift like that my son asked for, and I didn't write it down. You know, when I'm on my walk, I don't do technology, but I can push a button on my watch, record it and adds it right. So has to be fast, because I don't want it to take up any more bandwidth than it has to. But at that very moment, I have now cleared up that much cash in my brain that much. Whatever it is memory in my brain, or capacity continue to do thing that I want to do. That is like the start is just an not paper is a problem. Paper gets lost, you know, I have notes everywhere. And I've resigned my fact I'm going to write things down. But those notes mean nothing unless it goes into my system. So it's loosely based on that. But then I've taken it, and I've created in all of the the routines in my day that allow me success. So even when I come into my office, I have an opening procedure in my office, turn the computer on an order that I'm doing things so I don't let the emails take control right out of the gates, I don't let the text messages and messages if I do what I need to do first. When that's done, then I moved here. And it removes chaos from your brain that removes distractions that removes that task switching. And then by being able to, because it's digital Send Email straight to it or text messages. You don't worry if I open that email I have or that text I have to answer now or I'll forget it. I just copy the copy it in there. Just copy it, paste it, put the person's name on it goes my inbox. I know on the back, don't I don't miss that stuff. Because I have a system in place. But then, as a father, let me speak to this as a father, as a father, how often when you're with your kids trying to have intentional time, or you're on a date with your wife, or you're trying to have emotional intimacy with your wife, which is should be your job number one, if you want to get laid, get into emotional intimacy with your wife. Yeah, you, you can't let your brain go in a different direction. You've got to be focused, well, things are going to come across your brain. Absolutely. So my wife even knows like I'm picking I'll tell you pick up my phone, I'm putting something in here, and then I'll put it right back down. Or usually when we go on a date. I'm like, here's my phone, and I'm like, I need my phone real quick. She knows what I'm doing. It's a little bit of an irritant. But I know that I'm gonna function at 200% instead of 50% with her at that point.

Curt Storring 53:14

Yeah, that is also good. And I I want to ask so many more questions. And we're at a time. Yeah, but one last point on that is just like I have Yeah, strongly been using first was Evernote. Now it's Rome. And like, I'm gonna check out this thing that you're talking about as well. Because it's like having another brain except like you say you get rid of all this, like batching and tasking and memory and all this kind of stuff from your actual brain. And just like throw it behind you and you won't forget it. And my biggest thing is just like I want the headspace and I know there's like a meditation app called Headspace. But I want the clarity and the emptiness that one thought at a time provides rather than like, oh, there's 50 things going on? What do I do, then they don't do anything. So I love that. And yeah, we'll definitely have to do another chat about this because like I said, 100 more questions. But then you are just fantastic at this, by the way, like this was so fun. This is so clear. There's so many actionable tips. And where can people find out more?

Scott Rammage 54:13

Yeah, I mean, obviously brotherhood of fatherhood is a Facebook group. It's just a Facebook group. I mean, it's a place for men to ask questions. And you know, I'd love to see more interaction. I'm post a lot of stuff from the from my interviews and try and connect men with men. It's a really great group so brotherhood of fatherhood on on Facebook. You can follow Scott Scott Ramage on Instagram, and or brotherhood of fatherhood on Instagram. Those are those are the best places to find me.

Curt Storring 54:42

Yeah. And of course listening to the podcast, brother. I would love to but same name. Yeah. Brotherhood of fatherhood. Amazing. Okay, Scott, this has been so much fun. Thank you, man for taking the time to chat with us today.

Scott Rammage 54:52

Thank you, man. I'm so pumped on what you're doing. I love it.

Curt Storring 55:02

That's it for this episode thank you so much for listening it means the world to find out more about everything that we talked about in the episode today, including Show Notes resources and links to subscribe leave a review work with us go to that's Dad.Work/Pod. type that into your browser just like a normal URL, Dad.Work/Pod To find everything there you need to become a better man, a better partner and a better father. Thanks again for listening, and we'll see you next time.

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